Lots of bugs in PNF

[Rob]

     Jerry,

     OTOH I appreciate the PNF charts.

     But, OTOH, QuoteTracker, the software you guys developed in your heyday, was a far BETTER "9" or "9.5" on a 10-scale. 
     In sharp contrast to QT, MedvedTrader is not even close to it.... currently, IMHO it is only a "6" on a 10-scale. 

     May I suggest you pay a professional SWQA guy for effective help, in order to locate and learn about the many-many issues that persist..
     Jerry, you have been soliciting free help for bug reporting, but, apparently, the last 4 YEARS has not had enough time for the free help... to do the job for you.
     Because, despite you working on it for many YEARS, 
     still the many serious issues/bugs that mislead, and these and many other discrepancies do persist and remain embedded.
     The followings are some of the issues that you, or somebody, should have noticed and corrected 4 or so YEARS ago.

     ISSUE #1: In P&F mode, erroneously and alarmingly the most recent/last days are completely messed up and MISLEADING... so how can traders rely on it?
      Chances are you have never noticed it, as you do not look for bugs. Or you do your unit testing on some stock with little or no after-hours trading
     The after-market trading gets painted, and it gets appended, even after you come back after the "after hours trading" has already ended. 
     The last day's after-market trades get appended/included/painted, which is wrong and misleading.
     This happens during after hours trading.... and the Xs and Os so remain, even after the after hours market has ended... even after a new day has started. 
     FYI, for instance AAPL did not drop to $173.8 during the "day" session of 3/6/18.
     And no, FYI, it did not start going back up again from $173.8 to 176.64 at 15:47:07 local time.
     FYI, the "after regular hours" part is NOT separated from the last day's "day" market action.... and, of course, it should be separated.       
     This is in P&F mode, if you choose "View => Extended hours => Never"
     Or, this is in P&F mode, AFTER the after hours trading has ended, if you choose "View => Extended hours => Last 2 days, during extended hours". 

ISSUE #2: MT provides a lot of false and misleading info. For instance, AAPL didn't open at 174.90. And, didn't reach #176.00 during the first 10 minutes  of the regular session on 3/7/18. And no, this is contrary to the data on my broker's website, so it did not come from them. However, if you've got a charting software that manipulates the incoming quote stream, then the charting software can, could, and will likely display many misleading things.

ISSUE #3: In P&F mode, erroneously, the most recent after hours trading is treated like as if it was NOT part of the "last 2 days" but it is. 

ISSUE #4: IF you choose "View => Extended hours => Last 2 days, during extended hours",.there should be a difference between "Last 2 days during extended hours" and "Last 2 days". 

ISSUE #5: In PNF mode, if you set it to "Last 2 days", definitely and erroneously it is unclear where the "day" starts, and where the premarket ends. FYI, yes, premarket starts at 7 am local time.... but the regular "day" session did not and does not start at 8:43:52 am local time today, at APPL, on 3/7/18.  

I hope this helps.

Rob

Edited March 7, 2018 by Rob
....

[Mike Medved]

Rob, just like we did with QT, we try to fix the errors that are reported. We are the same exact people that did QT, and MT uses much better and more modern programming techniques than QT did, because software development tools and techniques definitely improved in the last decade and a half.

To your concerns - it is a bit overwhelming when you just list all the bugs together. In general:

* Is all your writing referring to P&F charts only?

* Some of what you write (" AAPL did not drop to $173.8 during the "day" session of 3/6/18") I cannot see on my chart. It would help if you posted your chart snapshot or emailed it to us so we could compare what you see with what we see.

* One example: you write that AAPL did not open at 174.9 on 3/7/2018.  No, it didn't. It opened at 174.94. Which you would see on a candle chart. But on a P&F chart with a box size of 0.1, it would show the open of 174.9. That is the nature of P&F charting and how it should be.

* "Days" refers to the time period from rollover to rollover, or, in AAPL case, from midnight to midnight EST, if you choose the right timeframe for the chart. On MT charts, you see a double solid vertical line that separates days on intraday charts.

* If you can, please email our support email with each bug, and, if possible, illustrate it with snapshots.

Thanks

Mike

[Rob]

Mike,

Let me respond to your comments and questions...

1. As to the " it is a bit overwhelming when you just list all the bugs together" part...... My responses are....

A) When I wrote my original post I had a hard time wrestling with your word processor. The issue is, unless you write from scratch, your post will likely look kind of ugly. You guys need to find a better word processor. Example 1: Other than going through every single like of text, how do I delete all the tabs and indentations?  Example 2: These mandatory new paragraphs are annoying, ugly, and controlling. 

B ) How much more tof my own ime do you want me to spend on this group if bug reports? When starting a thread like this, I can limit myself to P&F charts. I can also place a few other minor restrictions on myself. But, all in all, what is it that you want? Perhaps 15, 20, or 25 separate pages of a well-detailed, professionally written bug report, together with all the documentation, including my proprietary trade secrets, and copies of charts (i.e. exhibits). And, then, you want all of this, for free?

C ) All in all what gets me is the (i) shockingly large number of bugs in MT P&F charts; plus (ii) the long-long delay before these issues are and have been surfacing, plus (iii) why is it that *I* have to do it? Can't you guys hire a SWQA guy who would systematically go through everything? This charting software is supposed to be a commercial money-maker chiefly for the benefit of you guys, Jerry and Mike. Yes, I'm aware that there are free users, too. However, this so called "free info" is of no value at all, when it's misleading. And it is frequently misleading.

D ) There are many-many additional bugs on MT P&F charts that I have not told you about.

2. As to your question on "P&F"........

Yes, this thread of mine is only about, and in connection with only MT P&F charts.

3. As to "Some of what you write"

A ) Here I must restrain myself. I can't give it away. I've got a system that has worked and will likely work in the next few days, too, provided I do not disclose it to anyone...sorry, I can't!

B ) I see no any indication whatsoever that you appreciate my bug report(s). You should appreciate that I have been giving up for you guys my valuable time, for free... but this is not the case here, for sure.

C ) You don't want to play the role of a judge, do you? The judge who wants (legal) proof before everything else? 

D ) Give me the benefit of doubt... but it's up to you...... think hard, and think again.... in the last 4+ YEARS have I ever misled you in any way, shape, or form?

4. As to "One example you write".....

A ) I used the "horizontal line" indicator on my P&F chart, while I was monitoring the market of AAPL on a separate OHLC chart... this is how I made some observations in my original post.......

B ) Box size, in general, is important. However, it's pretty much irrelevant when one is using "horizontal line" indicator on an MT P&F chart.

5. As to "Days refer to"...........  

A) You are not getting what I was talking about. I was talking about "days" because in "View" there are settings on premarket visibility. 

B ) I can plainly and easily see the vertical lines that separate the days..... however,

C ) Separation of days is not necessarily good. In P&F charts there should be a flow of Xs (or Os), and that flow should not be interrupted by vertical lines for the separation of days. However, this is a separate issue that I have not even lmenrioned so far. Because there are way too many bugs..........

D) In my original post I was talking about the recent/last days of my AAPL chart because I especially noticed how the most recent/last day was (and still is) completely messed up. I noticed that it was definitely MISLEADING. That is why I posed the rhetorical question similar to the following:."How can traders rely on this?"

6. As to "If you can, please...

A) I understand what you're asking for. You're asking for additional help. And you want it free, too. You want a well-detailed, professionally written bug report, together with all documentation, including my proprietary trade secrets, and copies of charts (Exhibit A, Exhibit B, etc.).

B ) Surely I would like to see progress. Surely I would like to see you guys succeed with this project. However, there are many additional factors, too. Such as... (i) I have my own life. And, (ii) for example, isn't it grossly unethical to market or promote any software that -- wittingly or unwittingly -- misleads traders and investors?   

I hope this helps.

Rob

Edited March 8, 2018 by Rob

[Mike Medved]

Rob, as I already mentioned, when we see bugs, we fix them. When someone reports a bug and we can see what he means, we fix them. We definitely appreciate bug reports and have stated that numerous times.

Saying "P&F is screwed up" is not enough. Tell me, specifically, how it is screwed up. Preferably in a language I understand and with snapshots. I definitely don't need your proprietary trading secrets. But give me a snapshot of a P&F chart (remove all your proprietary trading stuff from it) and tell me what you see in it that is wrong.